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Newest Member: 2xBetrayal

General :
"Do I Even Know What Cheating Is?"

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 11:58 PM on Thursday, April 9th, 2026

I have more questions about my own relationship to ask later but this particular one I've been looking for advice on for a while in concern to my writing, but fundamentally I think this is probably a personal question too so that's what I'm asking here. (Alternate version is currently my bio for later reference)

My experience and perspective on things is not remotely normal, I've tried to ask several writing forums about this but the topic made them uncomfortable, and I really hope its okay to ask here. (Also since this one references my writing at the end I wasn't sure to put it here or in off topic)

....

The List of Things:

• I'm ADHD/Mildly show stronger Autism symptoms (I don't think this factors nowadays but it did cause the original delay in me learning how to date/the expectations)

• I'm a sex positive Demisexual with a high libido, and possibly Demiromantic too but we haven't been able to confirm that. (Translated, the above means I personally struggle to feel sexual attraction towards individuals until 'a bond has formed' which to my perspective is becoming randomly and extremely horny months or years later. It can be annoying, especially since I have a high libido to begin with and nothing to direct it at. I've found some outlets gradually that are able to work on me, but it was not a 'just google something' solution I've heard people suggest before. It took more than two years of training and conditioning myself for the 'pictures' or 'video' methods to even start to give something.)

• I have Quasiplatonic tendencies. As mentioned with the above, it can be difficult to find and 'aim' a target for 'desires', which results in functionally finding outlets for erotic activity and emotional attachment with my friends etc in non physical and codependent ways. (aka *THIS WILL BE IN A RELATIONSHIP POST LATER* I'm not only here to interview people or anything like that)

• I was essentially a Incel/Stalker Ex Boyfriend but now 7 years reformed (used bio gender for account if that factors in). Behaviorally/mental health wise, I'm past everything but seeing the worst in others was how I lived for a period of about 9 years. (I've done an ask about anonymous about confessing this knowledge/experience to my to-be-someday in-laws, and got a decisive 'hell no' and some choice insults, which now has be a bit worried about acknowledging that it happened the way I used to bring it up in interactions/getting to know people. I stressed the years but the answers trended towards being an 'if ever than forever'/'reacting like its recent' just from the terms Incel & Stalker in the question.) ['Stalker' behavior only happening in the very first quasiplatonic attachment situations, debatably at 3 different people but at least two, and that was enough for me to notice I was growing possessive/obsessive over people like it was a relationship when it wasn't.]

• My main experiences of dating has been a (mostly?) mutual separation in which they found someone more local and to their tastes while we were still in an active relationship. I have no idea if this weird pattern of being dumped after they kissed/slept with someone else already and that still being a conversation is normal. All I know for sure is it did hurt and they didn't feel very emotionally invested in me in some cases or just found something better in other years long relationships. Some I'm still in contact with while some drifted, but at the initial break up we remained friends for a period afterwards. As mentioned I have no idea if this level of direct communication is normal or if it counted as cheating to be dumped after the act occurred. A lot of people who did agree to be girlfriend/boyfriend to me are poly, which I don't mind, but 'dumped after replacement is found' was the standard in all that counted as more long term and I thought serious.

....

Rambles out of the way, the kind of relationship I have in the series I've been working on through all of that is one about (typical?) marital cheating in which one or both partners in marriage get emotionally invested/have sex with someone or someones outside the marriage.

Originally this plot point was a mythology reference, but the longing/unrequited/tragic aspect was original to the work from the above life experience. Now though I keep questioning and fixating on it, trying to figure out why its such a strong theme that I don't let go of even though I have some difficult in making it how I want the story to be. Likewise the fact the story still counts as 'Romance' (+Tragedy/Thriller) has a lot of people both interested and iffy with it. I don't try to make it positive in anyway, but the Protag is the person who falls for manipulation and chases after a married woman; even if years later she realizes that what she did (nearly getting herself killed and later leaving him to die in a fire she caused) was undeniably cruel especially because he still believed the lies, mourned her, and blamed himself even after everything she knowingly did. This being the reconciliation aspect, although 'getting back together fully' is still a plot point I've been debating; they're 'together' enough to be interacting with each other but they live separately and in no way coparent the kids that were directly hurt by said affair. He is the only one parenting and making excuses for her/trying to convince the kids she was a good person 'while she was alive'. (Her having a crisis in the background not knowing how to parent or really care but being guilted.)

And for the question of 'which character most like you' etc; "The Idiot", (Protag), the guy who is the affair partner and fell for the manipulation/latched onto her in the first place, is the closest thing I have to a self insert (as I don't do them).

So, yeah :/

"Do I even know what Cheating is?"

CuriousWriter

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KitchenDepth5551 ( member #83934) posted at 12:03 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

You came on a website for people who are in pain from infidelity and its consequences to ask about a writing plot? Ugh. Please don't. That's just not ok, bro.

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 12:35 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

@KitchenDepth5551 I'm not just here for writing. As mentioned I have other questions, I'm just starting with this because I don't know where I stand or if my relationships count as because its been so weird. Please read the full post, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding but I promise I'm not only going to talk about that.

CuriousWriter

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 12:38 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

Also I do hear what you're saying, and if the comments are unanimous on this I'll delete this post and only do the direct relationship ones. But it will just be a repeat of this sans the writing reference and with my info on my current relationship.

CuriousWriter

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 12:57 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

I have read the rules for posts already and drafted and edited before making a post. I do have a lot more personal questions but I wanted to just start with a baseline. I'm truly sorry if this is in the wrong area or isn't close enough to the rules. I'll fix it where I can or make a new post based on your feedback.

I really am sorry. I have a lot of anxiety about posting things or even discussing this kind of personal stuff online. I don't have good experiences actively posting on forums and I don't want to cause anyone problems. Please let me know what to do and again I'm sorry for not doing this right. :(

CuriousWriter

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Pogre ( member #86173) posted at 1:11 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

Whether it's your sole intent or not, asking a group of people who are all devastated and still reeling from an affair for tips on plot points in a book involving infidelity... well, read the room. I'm assuming you know what "triggers" are?

That said, I'm still trying to wrap my mind around how someone could be demisexual and have a strong libido at the same time...

If you want to know "what cheating is," avail yourself of the resources found in the healing library at the top. There's a drop-down that will lead you to several articles and many go very in depth about the subject.

[This message edited by Pogre at 1:11 AM, Friday, April 10th]

Where am I going... and why am I in this handbasket?

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 1:14 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

Clarifications:

For the 'mutual' mention, I was still hurt by it each time and was messed up for over a year and a half each time just spiraling, but it also felt like I was the only person feeling that and it was wrong to say anything to them about it. For the longest time it felt like I wasn't worth wanting, I desperately clung onto anything, but I never blew up on people after what happened when I first realized I got attached to my friends. I've always been so scared of messing up and being a burden, and especially about speaking up when things feel wrong. Learning to not be a jerk took away what self esteme I had and its taken me a long time just to be able to talk to people and not panic about them hating me. Or just to confide things in friends or my girlfriend and know they won't freak or ditch me for saying something stupid. And it always feels like everything I say or ask is stupid.

CuriousWriter

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Letmebefrank ( new member #86994) posted at 1:28 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

Tell your situation linearly and people here can try to help you through it. Don’t ask for help turning infidelity into a really cool story.

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Pogre ( member #86173) posted at 1:29 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

For the 'mutual' mention, I was still hurt by it each time and was messed up for over a year and a half each time just spiraling, but it also felt like I was the only person feeling that and it was wrong to say anything to them about it. For the longest time it felt like I wasn't worth wanting, I desperately clung onto anything


This is all pretty normal. Being cheated on is a very deep wound. Some have described the pain as being worse than losing a loved one. Only topped by the loss of your own child. PTSD symptoms are common and the trauma can linger for years. Some folks have come here still messed up from betrayals that happened 20 or even 30 years ago.

To answer one of the questions I think you asked, a partner getting involved with someone else before breaking up with you would indeed be considered cheating.

Where am I going... and why am I in this handbasket?

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 1:44 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

(Still not sure how replies work)

@Pogre

"Read the Room" - I tried and this was my second attempt that seemed a good balance of saying everything, but I'm going to fix this and make this better / delete this and try harder and come back in a few days with a better worded post. Again I am very sorry I messed everything up this bad. :( sad

"Demisexual vs Libido" - This one I have to answer a lot. The best I can tell is that the first time I actually made a connection/crush at 16 it clicked and never stopped happening in waves. I had my first contact with things [City of Angels, Sex in the City, Rob Roy, Late Night Direct TV] when I was 9 and puberty/period started after that, but it never once happened and I never had any romantic interest until that obsession and sex drive hit out of nowhere, and I didn't know how to react to it. What we've collectively figured out since is that I'm still Ace and still have a lot of trouble connecting desires to people, but the waves of libido don't stop they're just not triggered by any person or media. For Aces, 'Sex Positive' just mean you aren's disgusted or physically repelled by sex, and there's a lot of ways people express and deal with it. For me I'm one that can function just fine on alone time and don't feel desires to interact with anyone but my partner (and that's only because we're at a point 3 years in where that connection has triggered and we can celebrate me being able to feel aroused again). [It sounds very dumb but genuinely we and my friends have this reaction because its so hard for me to manage that.]

"Resources" - I've looked into a lot over my life and that's part of what lead me here. I haven't been able to find anyone comfortable enough to discuss it whether its about writing or me, and those who have listened have some of the same confused questions like above. I don't mind discussing most things but there are some parts I'm not comfortable with, though I will try to explain where I can. I try my best to be respectful and I don't normally ask to be respected back or anything aggressive like that, but I have been told I should do that more.

CuriousWriter

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 1:50 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

@Letmebefrank


**DEFINITELY** not asking how to 'write a cool story'. That part I'm very aware would be insensitive. I do want to know though if my personal experiences are even relatable as that felt safe enough to ask and it has been worrying me for a long time. I had similar questions to a romance writing group trying to figure out if what I've felt is even 'love' in the same sense as everyone else, since it me it feels a lot like lust and obsession as my affection and care it kinda the same to everyone I know personally. Its a difficult conversation and I know with them it did annoy a lot of people at first, but gradually they adopted me and that experience is a lot of why I felt brave enough to tempt posting here and getting to know all of you.

CuriousWriter

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 CuriousWriter (original poster new member #87233) posted at 2:18 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

(Hopefully formatting works)

**~TRIGGER WARNING~**

@Pogre

"This is all pretty normal. Being cheated on is a very deep wound. Some have described the pain as being worse than losing a loved one. Only topped by the loss of your own child. PTSD symptoms are common and the trauma can linger for years. Some folks have come here still messed up from betrayals that happened 20 or even 30 years ago."

It was kinda like my experience with suicidal depression, but two of them also happened in the middle of all that so it might have just compounded it. It was a lot of chest hurting, crying, feeling back to square one on feeling isolated and me not really understanding how to improve on my people skills which were already at their lowest. It took a lot of growing to get better at dating and pleasing people, but the worries definitely stuck around on my mind and in every interaction.

PTSD wise, this happened with one of the quasiplatonic ones and an ex-friend. Namely the first stuck as a memory that gave me a lot of anxiety and made me panicking about acting too close to people vs me desperately trying to understand what was wrong with me to have had that sudden attachment and obsession. (It was very much a 'what is wrong' at the time because I was still losing it mentally over other things in my life and if genuinely felt like my sexuality was another symptom I was going insane and I genuinely just wanted to go back to not feeling anything about a person ever).

The bit with the ex-friend meanwhile was several years later when it felt like I was fully recovered from everything. It started out as a fight between two others that I wasn't around to moderate, me playing peacemaker afterwards making them feel distant, and then when I got a text message I treated it as normal and unknowingly gave unwanted advice/unwanted constructive criticism. Ex-Friend freaked out as that was the final straw, and that triggered me back to my panicky message spamming and what is probably considered stalking there account, which they already had trauma about and completely burned that bridge. Even though that time of me relapsing was short it was actively giving me panic attacks for 2&1/2 years and it took me till 4&1/2 for me to let go of the fact they wouldn't be coming back and also wouldn't go mental on me for removing their access to things of mine. The fear that they'll be upset with me if we meet again has lingered 6+ later, even though their last message did say they didn't feel as personally angry at me and my friend (who was the one they were mad at) insists that wherever they are they absolutely aren't still mad about that. And from what I can tell it was only the fact I relapsed into a bad behavior that gave me that prolonged anxiety and paranoia.


....


"To answer one of the questions I think you asked, a partner getting involved with someone else before breaking up with you would indeed be considered cheating."

In a way that's good to hear. I've been told twice that it wasn't since I knew they were poly and it was the assumption at the time that poly people can't cheat. Plus the whole part about them coming to tell me first and me not getting angry or feeling a stronger attachment to them being gone. (But as mentioned above, that feels more like part of me essentially 'malfunctioning' when it comes to attachment and that something still happened even if I couldn't express or understand exactly what.)

CuriousWriter

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BackfromtheStorm ( member #86900) posted at 9:49 AM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

I can tell you something about the raw workings behind it all, both for cheated and cheaters.

I will make my best attempt to not over complicate, but for the reasons right below, in the opposite from vis a vis conversation where I use words sparingly, here I have to hit you with walls of text to convey the thoughts.

Let’s begin first with labels and definitions.

Words have meanings, they are a tool to communicate thoughts and emotions outwards, along with tone and body language. We miss the 2 necessary companions to words here, because the limitations of the medium, to fully receive your communication as you feel it originally, hence I do get your struggle in getting understood.

When you use this tool a lot, there is a natural tendency of words turning from vehicle of meanings into labels, which are a energy saving shortcut to quickly direct your audience towards a point you try to make. The negative of labeling is individual and emotional dehumanization and misinterpretation merged with insecurity projection, and tribalistic performance.

As they are a energy saving shortcut for the speaker, they often become a effortless replacement for deeper self awareness for emotionally uncentered individuals, who seeking to regain their balance but afraid of the consequences of a real internal deep dive, take the shortcut of identifying into a "close enough" label, maybe without having even properly understood it first, and the ego soothing deriving from this obfuscates and quiet for a while the still unresolved issues hiding inside them.

This is a rooted need because we all are seeking our balance, and when you are vulnerable such a quick fix or patch seems very attractive, attractive enough to become identity , through the very push of one self ego desperately trying to silence the internal dissonance that imbalances you emotionally.

Though it is a projection of your ego taking a shortcut, for its self preservation, instead of taking the label’s meaning as a starting point for a deeper reflection on your inner self.

Give it some time and visibility and this perfectly human tendency becomes tribalism, obscuring your healing rather than helping it, so a well meant useful linguistic shortcut can get quickly twisted from a useful tool into a superficial, stereotypical and distracting social mask.

This is bad for a person with issue, as most people here can tell you, the general descriptors can heal you or devastate you, if you don’t do the work using them as a starting point for your unique individual life experience.

(I kept it as short as I can, but I believe you should see the starting point.)

You use a lot of labels, likely because of your profession they are an efficient tool to share ideas and knowledge within your circle. But you being used and able to decode can blind you to the effect of what I explained above. Is like when doctors speak with colleagues and non medical people, they need to get back to layman terms even if it is energy taxing, if they want to be understood.

I get it, but as you see it is causing confusion, because here you are touching into matters that hurt people at a deeper emotional level and at an identity shattering level, that is difficult to comprehend until you get the unfortunate reality of living it.

It was explained to you well, that the trauma of betrayal is one of the worst kind of trauma that a human being can inflict upon another human being. It’s worse than violence and war ptsd, loss of loved ones, and I agree it’s just below the loss of your child, adding that this loss was chosen planned and executed by a close person who you trust. It’s not a tragedy it is an intentional and gratuitous act of choice , performed for a dopamine high.

That should give you the magnitude and help you to understand why you came off as insensitive to the BS and WS who replies here.

About your curiosity:

Betrayal is a kind of abuse that stems from a deep rooted unresolved issue of the betrayer, often tied to childhood trauma, that seeks for outside validation to soothe the emotional chaos those unresolved issues stirs in the wayward partner.

It is not a breakup or heartbreak, that’s just nothing in comparison, it is relational shock, attachment wound, identity annihilation. It changes your brain and body chemistry often for the rest of your life unless you manage to recover, and is way more sneaky and subtle than other kinds of abuse and violence, because it comes from your inner world, not an external threat.

This is devastating.

Mind that the betrayed partner is not the only victim here, you may call them the innocent or sacrificial victim, but the cheating partner is the one that often digs a deeper hole, a darker abyss for themselves. Is just matter of time before they fall into it too, time bought by pushing in their betrayed partner first. But the WS has betrayed themselves as well, and you cannot run or abandon yourself, once you choose that, it will haunt you forever.

What is the common thread for a betrayal to happen?

You will find that the most common issues are about a deeply rooted emotional chaos seeking for order through external validation of a fantasy that gets "realized" through another emotionally unstable and broken person (the affair partner), it’s all based upon lies, deception, selfish and self sabotaging performance and projected fantasy of a different "you " someone who a broken ego sees as stronger, happier and powerful in its Fantasy, but turns out to be weak, incredibly sad and repulsive right after the dopamine induced chemical high fades.

The common traits are most often, low self worth, people pleasing, perfectionism, emotional unavailability or avoidance, compartmentalization.

There are others but those are very common.

Usually the life keeps this in check, silences the inner voices, routine and ego idealization convince you that you are a grown up, stable and loyal person who would never do something that terrible, you are not the villain of your story, you are the hero. When life routine changes or something happens, the checking patterns break, and the unresolved issues resurface. If the person is still refusing to face them, we move to the next step below.

How it starts?

By labels and projection from the ego, at some point the internal emotional chaos pushes you to be soothed by a feeling of needing validation. Since those traits make it hard to give yourself the love and validation you deserve from inside, the easiest way is to find someone as desperate for the same validation (the AP) and you both end diving into a deeper chaos that is initially exciting but raises the stakes of your own chaos much higher and eventually leads to a complete collapse when the reality doesn’t hold up to the fantasy, as it rarely does.

The labels you use are all variations of "I am a good person, I deserve this, I am not doing anything wrong to anyone ", in complete dissonance to your own emotional awareness, your ego creates this performance and persona while lying to yourself as much if not more than you lie to your betrayed partner, about your choices and behaviors.

Most people crack at this, it doesn’t bring them happiness it brings them misery and a soul void that cannot be filled, the emotional dissonance is the very thing that triggers the excitement chemicals in your brain, that just happens to be the same chemicals love produces, only in a different mix, so your ego projects into this fantasy even more, and it escalates.

This is why when the affair is found out, or when the cheater gets abandoned by the betrayed partner and becomes free to live with the affair partner, the house of cards collapses and the shame, regret and guilt replace the hype.

Depending on how the wayward responds to this, there’s people who double down on the denial and begin spiraling into this behavior, protecting their ego because the pain to look yourself in the mirror is just too horrific. Other people learn one of the hardest lessons they will have in life. They begin to look inside, starting the long process of healing the issues that lead them there, becoming aware and better person, capable to love and validate themselves and to receive love without neediness from someone. In short, safe partners. The sense of guilt for what you have done will likely be with you until the grave, and the disgust for your choices will be a trigger that keeps coming back. But you can become a different person, a better, lovable, worthy one, unbroken. The WS heals the WS.

Some very brave even go through the attempt to reconcile with their betrayed partners, and this is a big deal because it demands them to be vulnerable towards someone who they hurt and destroyed beyond what words can express.

—-

About the Bs . You probably get the idea more easy about this.

It cannot be described, only felt.

I can give you a picture as a metaphor.

Imagine you allow someone closer to you than anyone in your life, including family, could ever be. Your most intimate inner world, reality dreams, memories, present and future. They gladly take what you have to give them, and they convince you that they are indeed part of your world, they deserve to exist there next to the very pillars of your existence and identity.

Then all of a sudden, while you are still living as they are your most treasured thing in your world to protect and preserve, they sneak someone else into your inner world, burn everything to ashes and shatter the pillars of your identity to dust. Then when you are down there bleeding they gladly and cheerfully rape you, your children (real or future) kill you and them in front of your eyes all while laughing and holding hands through the havoc. Then they go to your past, do the same, torture rape and murder, with your childhood you. Then they go to your future and do the same to all your dreams and plans, offspring and so on.

And when your soul dies and cries for justice, you find out the court declares them innocent and presents you with the bill to pay. And delivers you to their mercy, While they are laughing and mocking you.

You end up bleeding, shattered and empty, with no more present, past or future, with a life sentence for a crime you never committed.

Is not that far from the emotional state you will feel in, in truth it might just be worse than this, but again, hard to explain.

You will carry an attachment wound "I am not chosen. I am not enough. I am replaceable " that will mess up your emotional life and future unless you heal it. It does take years and years to survive this trauma, but while not easy, it’s possible to heal in part or sometimes even fully.

The only positive thing about being the betrayed partner, is that if you leave your abuser, you will someday, completely heal. You will have scars but they won’t hurt nearly as bad once you removed the betrayer from your life and memory, they will fade with time, as they never existed.

If you loved your betrayer deeply enough that you give them a chance to reconciliation, you will never fully heal, I don’t believe it is possible, you trade your love for keeping the person who stabbed you alongside your path, blade lodged forever in your heart, you will get used to the pain and will partially heal, but when the road has bumps the pain will always wake up.

This decision of the betrayed is usually painted in the mainstream as a weakness and ridiculed. Your choice what to call it.


@pogre
I know you were worried about me being brief with my replies lately, but whenever I have time I will contribute with the usual wallpaper of text. See?

[This message edited by BackfromtheStorm at 10:26 AM, Friday, April 10th]

You are welcome to send me a PM if you think I can help you. I respond when I can.

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Pogre ( member #86173) posted at 1:11 PM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

I'm not going to pretend I understand poly relationships, but from what little I do know there are usually very clear, solid and agreed upon ground rules. You only get involved with other people under strict rules, and those rules can vary between different poly couples. Sometimes it can be to not get romantically attached outside the relationship and keep it physical only. Sometimes it's avoiding mutual friends.

It's different for different people, but both parties need to be constantly informed and in the loop, and both parties need to agree upon any third party entering the relationship. There's constant and open communication with very clear rules and very clear boundaries. If one of the people in a poly relationship doesn't observe the rules or breaks in any way from the agreement then that's cheating. Period. If you're in a poly relationship and your partner steps outside of a pre-agreed upon boundary then it's the same as someone in a monogamous relationship having an affair.

At least that's my understanding of it. If you and your partner didn't have the conversation or clear boundaries then that was likely a mistake. If there aren't rules and boundaries in place it can have disastrous results. It sounds like your former partner may have crossed a boundary with you, but if you didn't have the conversations that was probably a mistake.

I personally would never get involved in a poly relationship. I'm just not built to be able to handle sharing someone like that, but many do have successful relationships of that nature, and there are always very clear boundaries and rules in place with the successful ones.

@Storm - I know I've busted your balls for long replies before, but I really have come to enjoy some of your takes and colorful metaphors. I really liked your recent contributions to my thread in the R section. Don't change a thing! Lol.

Where am I going... and why am I in this handbasket?

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5bluedrops ( member #84620) posted at 4:20 PM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

Its really simple. First you have to define relationship. And then betrayal. After that, cheating in our modern parlance is just a specific variation.


A relationship is when two or more people have a mutually formed and agreed upon understanding of each others value, roles, and boundaries. A unifying bond between the parties, founded on symbiotic sharing of life, activity, time, responsibilities, needs, and desires. A component of this bond is trust in the other participant(s) good faith towards its core principal mission; usually to share meaningful life experiences in a fulfilling and rewarding manner for all involved.


This ideally applies to friendships, romantic relationships, business, nearly any non destructive mutual arrangement with a beyond arms length level of social entanglement.


Betrayal is when a participant in relationship unilaterally and surreptitiously chooses to violate the spoken or unspoken checks and balances that make relationship viably beneficial to all other participants for a purpose beneficial to only the betrayer, at the detriment of the others. It can be covert or overt, but generally the trust created in the relationship is strategically exploited by the betraying participant to carry out the acts that harm the other participants. The rogue participant profits from subtraction, either exiting the relationship after springing the betrayal for one big payoff or keeping its activities covert for long term enjoyment of both the understood arrangement in the relationship and their secretive, private undertakings concurrently.


Theres really nothing else to understand, but this next part is more specific.


So whats cheating, other than an exciting, fast paced party you werent invited to?


Cheating is having your trust and vulnerability exploited by someone with whom you have a shared understanding of relationship who wants to use you for what they see as your useful value to them while they consume sexual/romantic experiences outside of your mutually defined value set. It is theft of your life. Cannibalism of agency.

Because an orgasm or heart emoji from some outsider felt good and they wanted it more than they held you sacred. They were horny or lonely in spite of you and they could and they did. Thats the why. Thats the how in "how could you". All the emotional labor to understand what lead to it that we do here is just belaboring it. Such a waste.

They wanted to eat a burger so they did. And sure, having to see how the cow felt about that having been their lifes purpose to the burger eater, might provoke some regret or contrition, but everyone who eats a burger knows what happened to the cow before they take a bite. And they dont care. They want to eat it anyways. And they dont regret shit. Because getting confronted by the cow you ate aint a thing.

So take some salt when you hear about how remorseful some of these folks are as the consequences of their own bitter makings unfold. Its a rarer bird than they’d have you believe. Dont believe me? Go look at the affair friendly spaces elsewhere. The contempt towards the idea of having guilt and remorse when it gets discussed is illuminating. In between whining about their spouses and affair partners not being good enough for various reasons, They openly laugh about caught waywards having to simulate remorse to keep their betrayed spouses, and they pray their lies hold enough water to not join them, while trading tips on how to do just that.

Depressingly self aware and introspective of what they are doing, They wallow in shit like pigs and enjoy it thoroughly, flying as close to the sun as proudly as possible, and claim it wasnt all that on the tail end of being caught. Up to that point its a fuckin blast for them. And they arent demons. Just. Regular. People.

They might love you, and they might not. But youd be stupid after what they did to take their word for it! You are to them more means to an end than person, love or not.

Pastors, doctors, nurses, teachers, mothers, fathers, each of them, just regular people. Most of em, this is the worst thing theyve done. But theyll tell you themselves that if they regretted it theyd never have started. Unless they got caught, of course, or confessed for some reason. Then its suddenly the biggest misunderstanding! Such remorse, such mistake making. Please save me from what I did etc. I’ll learn to be sorry I promise! Please dont make my family and kids see me the way I am or take my safe person or your income from my equation or god forbid half of my shit! I really liked sleeping with you more, honest! It was just one time, never on the lips, ok maybe theres more but not much more etc.

LOL.

And Thats what cheating is.

posts: 130   ·   registered: Mar. 19th, 2024   ·   location: Ga
id 8893030
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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 4:28 PM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

IMO, cheating is violating any one of the agreements a couple mutually agree on. Unless there's mutual agreement, I don't see betrayal.

I think I'm reading in this thread about addiction to romance and/or love. There's a lot of stuff available on the web. I've heard Brenda Schaeffer speak on love and romance addiction, and IMO she makes a lot of sense.

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
d-day - 12/22/2010 Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 31818   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8893031
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BackfromtheStorm ( member #86900) posted at 8:23 PM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

@5 blue drops

So take some salt when you hear about how remorseful some of these folks are as the consequences of their own bitter makings unfold. Its a rarer bird than they’d have you believe. Dont believe me? Go look at the affair friendly spaces elsewhere. The contempt towards the idea of having guilt and remorse when it gets discussed is illuminating. In between whining about their spouses and affair partners not being good enough for various reasons, They openly laugh about caught waywards having to simulate remorse to keep their betrayed spouses, and they pray their lies hold enough water to not join them, while trading tips on how to do just that.

I can’t send you a DM so I allow myself a little off topic to ask if you can DM me about the affair friendly spaces. I am truly interested into seeing the other side and what goes through the human mind on this matter. Personal pain aside, I find the whole thing very fascinating and I am the kind of guy that digs in everything that piques my curiosity.

Thank you.

On topic again, I do believe the what you wrote has merit, I am of the impression that a good number of wayward partners do indeed double down on the cheating behavior, lies and manipulation, just because once you crossed that boundary it is far easier to pursue than to back step and work on your issues. Especially since the cheater profile is already one of weakness and insecurity, it takes bravery to admit it and look yourself in the mirror. Even harder to change.

That said , I do sense that the reformed wayward partners I met, talked or just read here on SI are genuinely exceptional, in the sense that they truly faced their inner ghosts and are working hard to make a change for betterment of their lives, wether or not they reconciled or lost their betrayed partner, it is still absolutely commendable and worthy of my respect.

I know other cheaters personally, I know how they talk and boast hoping you to give them validation for their shitty choices. I see the fallout that comes unavoidably wether the get caught or not, with time they spiral into a shut show, lose what they held dear and end up clinging to people who are just like them and get karmic retribution by passing to the other side, the BS side, and that crushes them as it crushed their BS.

Completely different story than what I learned here from pippin, hikingout, brave sir robin and others who I read from. These people actually changed my mind and perspective about wayward partners, that was pretty categorical and absolutely unmerciful (and I am the vengeful type who makes sure your dues are paid when you least expect it).

There is no hopium, here, just opening up my mind, which is not that easy unless you’re bringing strong evidence to the table.

And I am understanding a lot more than just my inner work

You are welcome to send me a PM if you think I can help you. I respond when I can.

posts: 493   ·   registered: Jan. 7th, 2026   ·   location: Poland
id 8893079
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5bluedrops ( member #84620) posted at 9:40 PM on Friday, April 10th, 2026

I cant seem to DM you either. How funny.

You can go see these places at the adultery or cakeeater subreddit. Guard your heart, have a puke sack nearby.

Im aware of Hikingout, Pippin, And BravesirRobin, and how helpful they are respectively.

I could say so, so, so much more, but sometimes the smartest remark is silence. Not always, but this time.

posts: 130   ·   registered: Mar. 19th, 2024   ·   location: Ga
id 8893092
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